In the last video I answered a question from a girl who was asking what book she and her fiance should read to prepare for marriage. They believe in mutual submission and love, and don’t agree with the husband being the head and the wife being submissive.
And I totally relate with that stuff because those are the passages in scripture that leave me asking, “what in the world does this mean?!”
What is this actually saying?
I don’t know. I have struggled through this.
What are our fears surrounding this topic of submission?
Have we missed it?
In case you missed it, here is a little message I left on the Love and Respect NOW Facebook page before this series began:
I’ve been sitting on this three-part series for a while. Not because I was scared about the content or my approach, but rather because I am discouraged by the debates and dogmatism I see in the online world when it comes to different topics discussed by Christians.
And I thought, “this will be one of those reactionary topics for people. (Understandably) Is it even worth it to address publicly?”
I decided yes, because the answer to the Ask Joy question is one that I hope will shed fresh light on the topic of Biblical submission.
So here’s my request from you:
If you decide to contribute to the discussion, please ask yourself: “Am I presenting new ideas that are respectful and contribute to people’s thinking in a positive way…
or…
am I not?”
One of the ways we can practice and prepare for how we will communicate difficult topics in romantic relationships is by how we treat people and topics in the online world of anonymity.
Here’s to wisdom, learning and being diplomatic over divisive!
If you missed Part 1 in this series, click HERE.
Part 3 is on its way…
Love and Respect (Now) is a division of Love and Respect. Please be considerate.
From My Heart
All of the Love and Respect Now Posts…In One Place!
Emerson & Sarah Eggerichs on Marriage, Parenting, Family of Origin, Work & Death
Fighting for Love (and Other Potentially Hazardous Cliches)
What are our fears surrounding this topic of submission? MMA fighters, Jiu jitsu wrestlers and military people get it, but I’m a lover not a fighter so how does this apply to me? There are fears with: teaching it, talking about it, the abuse of it, the misplacement of it, and the confusion regarding it-does it mean subjugation, suppression, and enslavement? There are conflicts created in submission, how do we handle those-especially when it comes to suffering innocently? Cultural enforcement of it and the lack of acceptance of it can frighten us. Submission extremist really freak us out; evil men and women that demand submission violently will bring out the guarded spirit in us. Then there are questions like: who established the standard of submission? What is right and true about it? Are there any beneficial qualities of submission? Is it possible that submission might be liberating when it is exercised wisely under the proper standard? How does “order” play into submission? Is it inevitable in the grand scheme of things? Who is/are good role models for submission? How does submission relate to humility? Is there a mission within submission? Will a nation, community, church, home, marriage or a relationship operate more in love and respect if we incorporate submission into our free will? So much to ponder and wrestle with but, I’m not tapping out …..yet!;-)
Thanks for this series. It’s a hard question, and some of the “man is the head” voices out there make that position so much harder to hold since they come across as jerks.
I completely agree that when we read the passages about husbands and wives we need to read them in light of the comparison to Christ and the Church. There is then absolutely a call to the husband to sacrifice his for his wife.
However, when it comes to mutual submission – when read in light of Christ and the Church – I’m not sure anyone would be comfortable saying that Christ and the Church should mutually submit to one another.
I know that is not what you’re saying here. Just wanted to add my two cents. Looking forward to your final installment.
Arlo thinks...
Great video again Joy; there are a couple of different ways to look at this, I will attempt to share what I have seen.
Issue #1:
I am hoping I do not come across chauvinistic here and I assure you, that is not my intention. As we are fed more and more from the world that we should “All be independent and no one should tell us how we should feel, look, think or be.” It is a natural reaction for women to not want to feel oppressed in any way, and nor should they be oppressed. As we see the oppression of women all over the world, I can totally relate to the fear some may have because that way of life may come to them here in America. Of which I hope to never see. As I have talked to some married and/or mature single women, they have communicated how “Freeing” it is to have a husband accountable to God for the spiritual raising of the family. With the husband being the head of the household, he is held accountable to God for the affairs of the family and the wife is held accountable to God for the way she encourages and supports him in his leadership. Even if his leadership is not what she “Wants,” God will hold each of them accountable for their roles.
Issue #2:
Most of the men I know today in the church are not leaders. Everything in the world tells us we are not to lead, but to feel. This is all covered in L&R. However, the older men are not teaching the younger men how to lead. As the world tells us all “we are not to follow, but do what we want” the men lose a very important part of leadership, knowing how to follow. There is a large gap between how the older mature leadership and the boys we are graduating from high school and college now days. These older mature men need to be teaching and training the younger men so they can lead the next generation. The fellow you used in your example in the video is exactly what I am describing here; you can tell by his response that he just thinks you are being disrespectful the he hasn’t been in the “follower” position before or he could articulate how you were being disrespectful.
He who has never learned to obey cannot be a good commander. –Aristotle
The man who has never made a mistake has probably never made anything. — Mike Reed
PS:
No DieHard III; Terminator 2 at least once a week!
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